A lot of great stuff to respond to, so I'll simply write a series of replies, below, in successive posts.
I'll do this "chronologically."
---
Quote:
Originally Posted by SCGT  Wow I see this sort of stuff doesn't just happen on Mustang forums. LOL |
There's really very few communities where there's always such drama.
As a hobby, this one is, er...entertaining.
Quote:
|
I look at everyones info and make the decision for myself.
|
And that's exactly what I'm after.
For the newcomer to be well-informed. I am a firm believer in "the best consumer is the educated consumer" mindset. I tend to research my purchases "to death," before I commit, and I get more than a little put-out when the salesperson knows less than I do.
As a car-enthusiast yourself, I'm sure you've met that type, on dealership lots.
Quote:
|
The reason there are so many types of detectors and jammers is because everyone has their preferences. The cheap stuff will fade away and the best stuff will live on.
|
Exactly - everyone not only has their own preferences, but also, their own unique set of needs and their defined budget.
All of these factors combine into a very complicated end-equation to determine what to buy, and how to complete one's setup.
In my role as a fellow hobbyist, what I hope to do is to serve as a guide for the technical aspects of the discussion, and, if-asked, to help someone figure out what system and setup would best-fit his/her unique needs.
To me, the budgeting part is easy. Just shop around a bit on the Internet - as long as the seller is reputable, then it's all good. In this particular area, I've simply got nothing that I can contribute as advice. The only extra consideration is that, to an extent, one should see these devices as an investment, not necessarily against a speeding ticket specifically from LIDAR, but rather, against the further hassle and monetary fallout that comes both during the traffic stop, as well as afterwards. These secondary costs are what's really scary.
Quote:
|
I saw Djram's walkaround video and that is FAR beyond me.
|
His V1/9500ci setup (discounting the ancillary devices) may be too extreme for all but the most hardcore, but what you'd proposed - the combination of the Escort ZR4 plus the LI - is precisely the jamming combination that he's running on his Mustang. And that's what I wanted you to look at, and focus on.
Quote:
|
I think the Laser Interceptor are far from me also at $1200 for the 4 set. That's kinda steep. Especially when I'm already buying a $1100 STI Remote.
|
That's a big concern indeed, but IIRC, the STi-R does *not* offer, standard in its package, the ZR4 jammers (and furthermore, is not capable of being fully-integrated with the jammer, requiring, instead, a separate control-box for the add-on of the optional ZR4 laser jammer).
Given the price-tag of the ZR4 is approx. $450 (before shipping), and the price of a dual-head LI is $700 (shipped) this margin becomes too close to call, particularly given the performance advantage that the LI enjoys over the ZR4.
If you're thinking, instead, of the Escort 9500ci, which comes, standard, with the ZR4 included, then yes, that's a hefty bill to swallow.
Quote:
|
I am wondering now if I get pulled w/ the lasr jammers in my front grill won't the cop know what they are???
|
A few enforcers may notice - but it would be
few, for sure.
These devices, while general-knowledge to many in the community, still do not see widespread use, and as-such, still escapes most's notice.
Similarly, if you did not have highly visible rear heads, the enforcer may not know that you have anything on the front of your vehicle at-all, as all that he/she sees of that aspect of the vehicle is through the scope of his targeting LIDAR instrument, and also, is, furthermore, at-speed and at-distance. Even when the vehicle is close-up, due to your road-speed, that's still going to be an eyeblink examination, at-best, and even trained eyes will have a hard time picking out the heads, given that you do take at least some care to visually camouflage them. Only the most curious of enforcers would again go to the front of the vehicle after the initial take-down has commenced - most will simply see your vehicle's rear profile in-detail, as well as your cockpit, of course (thus the need for foresight and planning in setting up your vehicle's countermeasures' in-cabin controls layout, as well as good discretion in actuating them - for example, not scattering things about so that you'll have to reach across the cabin, thus creating doubt and concern, and likely raising the level of engagement, by the approaching enforcer; to-wit, in my vehicle, I've got my countermeasures controls "center-stack," where I would normally reach to operate my vehicle's stickshift, anyway [ ref:
http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u...onsoleLIT2.jpg ] - as a result, flipping off the switches and closing the ashtray cubby trap-door to conceal the controls will not elicit overt concern from the enforcer, once he approaches the vehicle, and sees that I drive a stickshift) , from the physical "at-window" encounter.
Furthermore, nearly *all* of the laser-diode based systems also double-duty as functioning (albeit not to the point which you could "trust" it to actually park your car with!) "parking sensors," and through various means, some, such as the Laser Interceptor, can even "full time" as a parking sensor (i.e. that their jammer function is disabled), making roadside demonstration of such a device's nature very convincing.
[
More discussion about this in my reply post below, following. ]
Quote:
|
The type that go on the license plate frame are one thing, but the heads are kinda obvious.
|
Actually, to those in the community - enforcers, too - the ones that go "on/around the plate" is just as obvious.
Certainly, there are now plenty of aftermarket wired and wireless rear-view camera transmitters that can again confound the issue, but one brand that hasn't yet been mentioned here - K40 - has always had jammer products which utilized various forms of direct-to-plate mounting.
And K40 has also been around for the party for *quite* a long time - right in there with Blinder and Escort.
Thus, such a countermeasures setup is just as well-known.
[
And here, let me digress to add --? A "plate mounted" solution is excellent for center-mass and/or plate shots. However, as soon as the enforcer's LIDAR pans away from this area of strength (and remember, as a handheld device, it's all too easy, for any of a number of reasons, for one's "aim" to momentarily shift off-mark), punch-throughs become *much* more likely. This is a specific weakness of the Escort ZR4's sole rear jammer head, which is something that I will discuss in a little while, below. ]
Quote:
|
The ones I have seen in person are all hidden 'behind' the grill, but you all said that lessens the effectiveness big time.
|
Correct.
Currently, it is speculated that to have full-effectiveness, the outgoing beam should be allowed approx. +/- 5.5 degrees (11 degrees total) of vertical clear-space and approx. +/- 12.5 degrees (25 degrees total) of horizontal clear-space. *ANY* restrictions on this will DRASTICALLY affect jamming performance.
But at the same time, we've all see via
ircm's game-changing IR-videos (unfortuantely, these videos, due to their tremendously educational but too-specific content, caused
ircm some trouble, back in the day, and are sadly no longer available as a resource to the community - however you can still see its principles being applied by everyone from
The Goons to good fellow enthusiasts like
ELVATO and
Cbr from RD.net's CFL hobbyist group) that more than half of the battle is won simply by *_RECEPTION_*.
This is simply to say that without being able to "see" the incoming threat, even the most "powerful" jammer, even one with the best jamming algorithm, is all but useless - for without being able to see the threat, it will not respond, and with no outgoing jamming beam, there is simply no jamming to be had.
With the jammer head being recessed behind *any* form of grill mesh/honeycomb/latticework, etc., its receptive capabilities will be impacted to some degree - big or small - and the results can mean simply slightly degraded performance (i.e.
WK446's friend's R35 GT-R's Escort ZR4 setup) to drastic negative outcomes (i.e. in comparing the un-obstructed LI setup of
hockey2005's EVO IX, to that of the initially "behind the mesh" setup that was seen on
PMoth's EVO IX).
If you have to mount behind-the-grill, for whatever reason, be prepared to suffer some level of decreased performance.
It's a compromise that is worth the trade-off for some, and not-so, for others.
Linear Mode
